Animal Agriculture & Factory Farms

What's your stance?

Vegan - I love animals!
Carnivore - and don't tell me what to eat!
Not sure/undecided
Total votes : 13

Re: Animal Agriculture & Factory Farms

Postby Tora » November 29th, 2016, 7:19 am

Azdgari wrote:To the second point, I just don't find your logic compelling. If placed in human context, your logic would suggest that children who are born to warlords for use as child-soldiers, and wouldn't be alive if not for being bred pretty much specifically for war, are therefor ethically fine to use as seen fit. 'We bred them for this purpose so that justifies our actions' doesn't do it for me.

The difference is that Humans and animals are fundamentally different. Cows, pigs, and other farm animals aren't humans so the same logic doesn't apply. People aren't born and raised to be eaten and if someone tries that they should be shot. These warlords are sick and twisted. Humans and animals aren't equal. In that situation the warlord is an absolute piece of human trash.

Azdgari wrote:You draw a very hard line between humans and non-humans

Yes I do. I have no empathy for these animals. They aren't humans. Call me speciesist if you please, but honestly I don't care about them. They are lesser and they always will be till they develop the ability to speak, reason, and contribute in some form or fashion to the world. They are meant to serve a purpose for humanity. I know I sound like I'm completely heartless, but I just don't feel for them. A cow doesn't give his life for you like a dog. A pig doesn't serve people. The only animal I care for besides humans are dogs, because they can do a lot more than just be food. I still will save a person over a dog, but certainly would rather save a dog over a cow. Farm animals are just that in the end. You can take a farm animal anywhere, but in the end its just a pig or a cow or a sheep and will do nothing more than serve as food.
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Re: Animal Agriculture & Factory Farms

Postby Azdgari » October 11th, 2018, 11:32 pm

Hey Gemini--I've been thinking a good bit about climate change and reducing carbon impact and all that jazz recently, even before the recent UN report came out, and I'm curious about your perspective on this. I'm trying to move away from beef/pork to chicken/fish, which I see as a very strong way to not only reduce my footprint personally but to contribute to an economic push away from those sorts of meats.

To clarify that, the thought is that the fewer people consume beef, the lower the demand, and ostensibly those agricultural resources would be devoted to other more sustainable livestock (e.g. chicken/fish). As I type this, I realize this doesn't account for non-food products that come from cows, but I imagine that's definitely a secondary driver of cows as livestock as compared to food. But maybe I'm wrong and you can call me out! Anyway, I figure you can alter supply-side behavior in that way more effectively with food than, say, turning off lights. It's important to turn off lights, but the electric company can't exactly change their behavior much in response.

Anyway--you brought up the fascinating point earlier in this thread on how the distribution (and degradation) of arable land, versus the amount of pastureland, raises serious questions about the sustainability, from a 'feeding-humans' point of view, of a widespread move to vegetarianism. To what extent do you think that conflicts with the oft-cited goal of moving away from livestock-as-food due to their considerable carbon impact? Are there innovations like vertical farming, increasing yield through genetic modification, topsoil restoration, or other techniques that could increase the amount of arable land, or the productivity of available arable land?

I am, as I've said before, not very well educated on agricultural science, and have only 'hobbyist' understanding of climate science. But I'd love to learn more about the intersection between these two fields.
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Re: Animal Agriculture & Factory Farms

Postby DGFone » October 12th, 2018, 12:00 am

Since this topic was brought back up, I recently came across this interesting bit of information:

Currently, the world produces enough food to feed an estimated 10 billion people, i.e. a food surplus. So when you here a question of "how can there be hungry people", it's a question of food distribution, not production. But if all of the current land producing area was converted to using only organic food, the food amount would only feed four billion people, slightly over half the current global population.

Just to throw yet another wrench into the gears.
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Re: Animal Agriculture & Factory Farms

Postby Sigurd » October 12th, 2018, 5:06 pm

I don't eat red meat like pork amd beef because there's a lot of resources that are used to produce that meat. I eat poultry and fish however. As with treatment of animals I do believe that cows and pigs are sentient beings and that is a factor that must be considered, however, I believe feeding humans are more important. If We can treat farm animals well at the same time that is a good thing. Regarding organic food I believe that is an obsolete method, the chemicals we use are most cases harmless and non-organic food means higher yields. There are probably some chemicals out there who are really bad that should be banned but then it must be proved by science that it is bad.
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