"Good Luck"?

[PrincessKiara]

[quote="CalmSurrender"](even if it was unreasonable to expect a small bird to babysit two lion cubs!).[/quote]

^ THIS.


Personally, I`ve never believed that Mufasa intended to/ever used corporal punishment. Sure, Simba is scared, he knows his dad is pissed, he stood by and watched Mufasa kick the crap out of the hyenas, and Simba knows he`s in deep trouble for disobeying and nearly getting himself and Nala killed. Mufasa yells his name, and that alone would make any little kids knees quiver.

Zazu telling Simba "good luck" is to me a touching moment between them. Zazu may be a tad dramatic here, but considering the previous scene and Mufasas anger, it makes sense that he says it because he knows Simba is in for a serious scolding. Plus I think it shows that Zazu does care about the cub, despite Simba treating him with disrespect and clearly showing his dislike for the bird.
I love that Nala told Simba that she thought he was brave, if she hadn`t said anything to him when they were leaving the graveyard, she would have had to be given a line in the next scene before the cubs part ways. Instead, there`s room for a nice moment between Zazu and Simba.. the way Zazu looks down on the cubs and frowns at them shows that he thinks Simba deserves whatever he`s gonna get, but Zazu is also scared that he himself will suffer Mufasas wrath. When Mufasa says that he`s going to "teach his son a lesson," it sounds like Simba is gonna get more than a scolding, hence Zazu feels it appropriate to add a word of comfort to the cub.

[AnnaM]

I don't see why people dislike this topic. It seems to me the author was just legitimately asking for answers to questions he/she had thought of. The author does not deserve insults, though I understand frustrations at the never-ending possibilities, like some of the ones Julie detailed (good ideas) .

The only problem with the question I see is that there aren't many possible answers (drawn from official sources; non-official answers could go one forever). There are countless questions one could ask about TLK. They could go on forever. Example: I could ask "What did Zazu eat for breakfast on the day that Simba and Nala went to the Elephant Graveyard? Did this affect his energy?" And ArbyStrider stirred up a whole new can of worms. Yes, everything is not what it seems. It's possible that the producers intended the whole movie to just be about...some undisclosed something that is impossible to decode! Maybe even their views of the movies have changed since they made the movies! Who knows all the officials' intentions were? No person in the world! That's why it's all about individual interpretation/perception (although SOME explanations are more viable than others).

And I think people, including myself, like to "want" the characters to behave in accordance with their own values. Some people feel that Mufasa shouldn't have been mean to Zazu since Zazu did his absolute best to hold up the task he was assigned, and I agree with this 100%, only I don't think Mufasa was mean to Zazu! His tone of voice was stern, but all he did was command Zazu to take Nala home so he could talk to Simba. This was just like any other command from employer to employee, except in the tone of voice, but people (characters) can't be perfect and expected to always keep a monotone tone of voice. I don't think anyone should be blamed for accidents/other events, even of those accidents/other events are "their fault," as long as those accidents/events weren't "their intentional or negligent fault." If Zazu had acted carelessly (had not followed the cubs, had not tried to be constantly aware of their whereabouts, etc.) or even deliberately badly (lead them to the Graveyard on purpose) then appropriate "disciplinary action" by Mufasa would have been fine (Even expected...Of course, quid pro quo, you're expected to keep certain duties on board!).

Whoops. I had a Scar moment. No, I did that on porpoise!

And about what Mufasa did to the hyenas: no clear boundary is drawn between "relevant to topic" and "irrelevant to topic," but I don't find this totally irrelevant. It's all connected in the Circle of Life! But, even so, I think Mufasa SHOULD have done what he did. He SHOULD have acted with all his power to prevent the hyenas from harming his son, which he did. The hyenas willingly acted as Scar's killers, and Simba had a right to live (these characters have personhood). Murderers should be stopped before they finish their deeds! Mufasa was protecting not just SOMEONE's right to live, but that of his son, and parents have the responsibility of protecting their children.

PrincessKiara: I share your opinion. I can see how you, like me, (probably) like to assign certain values of your own to the characters you think are "good." I'm pretty sure you think Mufasa is a good character, and you probably think use of physical punishment on children is bad (or AT LEAST the kind as severe as the author was referring to--the kind that would cause Zazu to fear for Simba's well-being!). I also agree that the inclusion of the "Zazu comforts Simba" moment was a good one. I like to see the friendships between the animals of different species developed. Friendship is a good thing to me.

[Carl]

[quote]I don't see why people dislike this topic. It seems to me the author was just legitimately asking for answers to questions he/she had thought of. The author does not deserve insults[/quote]
You weren't here at that time so you don't know. This was about the 8,000th thread the author made about some topic like this and the author was a troll. He was deliberately riling people up and by the time this thread was made everyone was already tired of him.

[quote]And about what Mufasa did to the hyenas: no clear boundary is drawn between "relevant to topic" and "irrelevant to topic," but I don't find this totally irrelevant[/quote]
The topic isn't about the hyenas. It's about Zazu. And the OP kept making threads about the hyenas and saying the same thing in every one of them. Additionally, every thread he made that didn't relate to them, or sometimes even to Mufasa, he always would bring up "I can't forgive Mufasa for what he did to my hyenas."

He was being a troll. Yes we got more riled up than we should have, but he wasn't abiding by forum rules and he was getting on everyone's nerves.

[AnnaM]

Yeah, thanks for "filling me in" on that. It is a major annoyance when trolls post things that ruin peoples' efforts of keeping things organized, precise, well-thought out, and such, just because of silly whims. I pity trolls though. Probably because I secretly am a troll at heart waiting to "come out!"

Now hopefully I won't get in trouble for going off-topic here; I'm just thanking you for reading/responding to my post

[PrincessKiara]

[quote="AnnaM"]PrincessKiara: I share your opinion. I can see how you, like me, (probably) like to assign certain values of your own to the characters you think are "good." I'm pretty sure you think Mufasa is a good character, and you probably think use of physical punishment on children is bad (or AT LEAST the kind as severe as the author was referring to--the kind that would cause Zazu to fear for Simba's well-being!). I also agree that the inclusion of the "Zazu comforts Simba" moment was a good one. I like to see the friendships between the animals of different species developed. Friendship is a good thing to me.[/quote]

Thank you - Yes I probably tend to look with forgiving eyes on certain actions performed by characters I`m fond of, and I draw my own conclusions to the characters personalities based on what I see in the film.

[Animal of the Wild]

Again, I'm sorry I was a troll.

[EdtheHyena]

He was just saying he hoped Simba worked things out with his dad. Hasn't someone ever told you that?

[BrianGriffinFan]

[quote="Ninaroja"][quote="Simba the Lion King"]

What do you mean we only saw Mufasa briefly? When did we only see him briefly?[/quote]

If you think about it, Mufasa is only in 6 or 7 scenes out of a 20 scene + movie[/quote]


I strongly disagree! 6 or 7 scenes is hardly a minor appearance! And considering he’s only alive for half of those scenes, that’s definitely not a minor appearance. What on earth makes you think he’s a minor character???

[BrianGriffinFan]

[quote="Carl"]Simba would know what to expect, but we can't know what that would be as it is the only time we are shown that he punishes Simba. All we know is that Simba was terrified, so he surely expected something bad.

And, by 'briefly' I mean we aren't given much insight into Mufasa's character. We see him much less frequently than Simba or Scar or even Nala. And when we do see him, he's often angry and temperamental.[/quote]

The only times he’s really like this are a) when Scar neglected to show up to the ceremony for his own nephew and was incredibly rude and unapologetic afterwards, and b) when Simba deliberately did something that almost got both him and Nala killed. It’s only natural that Mufasa would react like that. I don’t think it’s fair to judge him as being “often angry and temperamental” based on these two instances alone. (Also, I doubt Simba would know what to expect, since I’m pretty sure he’d never deliberately done something that would get him killed.)

But I also disagree that we aren’t given much insight into his character. He’s clearly shown to be loving, brave, and wise, and to also have a sense of humor. As for him not appearing as much as the other characters, that’s not really a fair judgement seeing as he isn’t alive in the second half of the movie. (There are much better examples of this such as Rafiki, who only makes a few non-speaking appearances in the first half, and Timon and Pumba, who of course aren’t in the first half at all.) Additionally, Simba and Nala are obviously very different in the first and second halves of the film, due to maturing halfway through. Since Mufasa stays the same throughout all his screentime, it evens out better than you’d think. So yeah, definitely not fair to say we only see him briefly.

[BrianGriffinFan]

[quote="Ninaroja"]
Well you were the one asking "when did we only see him briefly"
[/quote]

I know this was from a while ago but to be fair, it was a perfectly legit question for OP to ask, since I think I’ve established we don’t “only see him briefly”. At least for a character who only survives half of the film.